Have you ever wondered why it is that women have to change their names after getting married and not the men? Now you have, and the reason behind it is because women didn’t have their own identities as humans back in the Middle Ages when last names started and they were either daughters of their fathers or wives of their husbands.

The practice carried on into the 21st century and is seen as more of a tradition of two people becoming one, forgetting the real meaning behind it. So this man was a bit offended that his wife didn’t want to have the same name, but was not willing to take hers. To settle the argument, he was encouraged by his fiancée to post it on Reddit and he received a big reality check.

More info: Reddit

Man was excited about having the same last name as his future wife and didn’t expect her to not want to change hers

Image credits: Kurt Farrar (not the actual photo)

The Original Poster (OP) and his fiancée have been together for 3.5 years and are planning to get married. They are in love and are living happy lives, but there is one big disagreement that they can’t solve, so the wife-to-be suggested doing a sort of a poll and asking people on Reddit what they think.

The disagreement involves his last name. He wants his fiancée to change her last name to his, but she refuses and suggests either him taking her name or neither of them changing their names.

You would think the argument stops here, because surely anyone who could understand one who doesn’t want to change their name is someone who also doesn’t want to change their name.

The author of the story believes that the same last name is one of the signs of a “true couple” but his fiancée thinks it’s not worth the hassle

Image credits: namelessfuture

But then start the nuances. The OP not only considers him having the same last name as his wife a sign that they are a couple, but he also would like his family name to live through his children, because he is the only guy in his family, while his fiancée has a brother who will carry her family’s name.

There could also be some unconscious resistance as well. Laurie Scheuble, an emeritus professor in the Pennsylvania State University that Bored Panda contacted explained to us why the husband was not understanding at first, “Men in the United States are socialized to view their last names as a constant in their lives. The norm is that men do not change their last names at the time of marriage and that their last names are a permanent part of their identity. They are also socialized to think that women change their last name at marriage as are most women. It is important to keep in mind that only about 10-14 percent of women make a nonconventional (keeping their birth surname, hyphenating etc) last name choice at the time of marriage. I know there are higher estimates floating around in the media but there are no empirical data to support these numbers. They are based on nonrandom surveys etc. So, this norm still operates very strongly. Although there are no data on the percentage of men who change their last name at the time of marriage, it is miniscule. In a random sample survey of 2,000 men, it would be a miracle if you picked up one man who changed his surname upon marriage. Most people have ‘heard’ of men who do this but they do not know any men who changed their surname.”

She also provided the most common reason why men refuse to change their names to their wife’s if she would suggest it in general, “It is somewhat of an attack on their masculinity. The social norm is men do not change their last name upon marriage. There is also concern about what their friends and family will think and will people think of them in a different, less masculine way.”

The Professor comments on the OP’s reasoning as well, “I think there is some concern in the general discourse about people not knowing about one’s ancestors if men change their surnames at marriage or if people hyphenate. Women have changed their surnames for centuries and if anyone has gotten lost in the geneology, it is women. I do think that conventional marital naming patterns are one of the remaining kinds of socially approved sexism.”

He also claims that his family name is unique so he would like his children to carry it because he is the only guy in his family, while his fiancée has a brother

Image credits: namelessfuture

At least the man in the story isn’t opposed to hyphenating their names, but his fiancée is not keen on going through all of the bureaucracy that is involved when you’re changing your name.

You have to get a new ID card or passport and driver’s license, all of your credit cards and accounts that have your name on them need to be changed, all of your ongoing contracts such as loans or insurance need to be revised, etc. Everything has to be done separately and doesn’t update automatically, so if you don’t really care to have the same name as your spouse, it seems like a lot.

People in the comments were pretty bothered that the OP wanted his wife to have his last name and completely disregarded her wishes. They also pointed out that it’s not the last name that makes them a “true couple.”

The OP was voted the jerk in the situation, but it seems that he actually took it well and when he said that he wanted to hear other people’s opinions, he genuinely meant it.

The man posted an update after the wedding and admitted that people saying he was wrong wasn’t very pleasant, but he learnt from his mistake and was able to discuss the issues people were pointing out with his now-wife.

The man would compromise to have hyphenated names, but the woman doesn’t see the point of going through the paperwork for it

Image credits: namelessfuture

He found out that his wife didn’t want to change her name not only because of the never-ending paperwork, but also because of the meaning behind a woman taking her husband’s name. The OP claimed that he had never thought about it and his wife didn’t know how to explain it to him, but it was easier when other people put it into words.

Although there isn’t much to say. Laurie Scheuble, explained to Market Watch that “The tradition of women changing their last names to match their husbands’ has its origins in the property transfer that took place upon marriage. Essentially, women went from being part of their parents’ family to becoming their husbands’ property.”

With women fighting for their independence from men, for being able to have their own credit card, for having a job and being able to participate in the country-wide decisions by voting, feeling like someone’s property doesn’t fit in the picture.

It’s weird that the husband wasn’t able to deduce that from the history of how women were treated as less than human, but Professor Laurie Scheuble wouldn’t be so judgemental, “Men obviously do not think of that history nor for that matter do many women. As a society, people are not educated about the history of marital naming. They are however socialized into the norms of everyone in a family having the same last name even though this is not accurate given the rates of divorce, remarriage, and cohabitation where households with people with different last names are common.”

The poster had also never thought about how his fiancée feels about the origins of the tradition of wives taking their husbands’ names

Image credits: namelessfuture

In the end, the couple decided not to change their last names and maybe in the future they could hyphenate them, so that both of them would have to go through the hassle of legally changing them instead of burdening one party.

However, when you start thinking about the children’s last name and if it’s also hyphenated and they want to keep it but add their partner’s last name, you start to think if it’s a good idea. Laurie Scheuble thinks that it’s difficult to have a hyphenated name, ” People (bureaucracies) tend to drop off one of the names and there is the issue of which name goes first and last. If people hyphenate their surnames or that of their children, they need to be aware of potential difficulties. As for children, they view whatever their family does as normal so if they have hyphenated surnames, it will be business as usual for them. I do know people with hyphenated surnames who use only one of them just because their surnames are long and complicated. I also think people with hyphenated surnames will make decisions about what works for them should they marry as we have no set norms as do some Spanish speaking countries.”

Image credits: Larry Lamsa (not the actual photo)

It’s nice to see that the man actually listened to his wife and people in the comments, took the criticism and used it to improve his relationship. Maybe in his case, he just needed someone to better verbalize his wife’s feelings, as it’s not always easy because we often assume that the other person knows what we feel despite not knowing what we really feel ourselves, other than frustration of not being understood.

What were your thoughts while reading this story? Do you think the couple’s approach to the problem was praise-worthy? How do you feel about the outcome? Why do you think people only admit their mistake when thousands of strangers on the internet say that they are wrong instead of listening to the person that actually matters? Let us know your opinions in the comments.

But he finally realized he was wrong and why his fiancée refused to take his last name after people in the comments explained what he was really asking her to do

Image credits: sare bear (not the actual photo)

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