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What a strange thing education is after all. We are all taught from our childhood that we should always tell the truth, and nothing but the truth, but the older we get, the more we understand that these are nothing more than conventions, and that the truth can sometimes hurt. Hurt worse than some weapons.

In fact, to be honest, the most truthful age in our lives is early childhood, when we have already learned to speak meaningfully, but have not yet learned to hide our thoughts behind a veil of hints and omissions. And in this viral thread in the AskReddit community, adults are opening up about the most brutal yet honest (or honest yet brutal) things they've ever heard from their own or others' kids.

More info: Reddit

#1

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults My father is a sober alcoholic. The binge drinker kind where he could go months sober and then drink his head off for weeks. He always was seeking to form "father/child" moments with me when drunk, often ending with me crying. During one of these times, when I was a teenager, I turned it around on him and held a long monologue, detailing very carefully how he was making me feel, how he was pushing me away. How I feared for my little brother if he were to see him do this. Asking him why he delighted so in hurting me. Ruthlessly, brutally in a calm tone of voice just detailing it all and ending it with "I've had enough. I will not say a single word to you if you even had just as little as a glas of beer."

He was silent for a long while, then stood up and left without a single word. And that is the last time he drank, he went to get help and have now been sober for almost 20 years. He says it is the most brutal, and most needed thing anyone has ever said to him.

Carlyone , Nicola Barts Report

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Tams21
Community Member
1 year ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Sometimes love is sweet and cuddly, sometimes love is brutal and unkind. But both kinds of love are a gift.

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#2

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults I work at an after school program with kids aged 5-12. I had recently had a miscarriage and told the kids I was no longer pregnant because they were excited about me giving birth in the future. I tried to let them know that "my baby stopped growing and it passed away in my tummy." Some of them were pretty bummed out after hearing the news. When I was leaving at the end of the day, I was saying bye to a few of them and one of the second graders who adores me yelled out "Sorry again about your dead baby!" For some reason it made me laugh instead of any other emotion. After so much crying from the actual miscarriage, I started cracking up and just said thank you.

shainajoy , Arthur Krijgsman Report

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Carolyn Lively
Community Member
1 year ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

It's been said that if you can laugh at it, you can live with it. Took me a while to apply this to my life, but when I did, I found that having a sense of humor will get me through rough patches in life.

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#3

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults Last Thursday, after I had a particularly stressful day at work, my 7-year-old said,

"The only job that matters to me is being my dad and you're awesome at it. And if mommy leaves you for another dad, I will always tell the new dad that my old dad was my favorite dad."

"Thanks. I love you. Where's your mom?"

damecourt , Biova Nakou Report

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One of the figures of old Hollywood once said... by the way, here you can see one more difference between a child and an adult. I, as an adult, came up with an equivocal wording that allowed me and my memory to keep a straight face to a certain extent, and a kid would simply say something like “I just don’t remember who said that!” So, I don’t remember who said it, but they said that 'it's impossible to outplay kids and animals as they live on set and don't play.' And you know what? This is damn fair - after all, while the adult actors are getting used to the role, the children are just living there.

#4

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults Kid: Daddy why don't you have boobs.
Me: boys don't have boobs.
Kid: why does uncle John have boobs.

Pepitonator , Izzy Park Report

#5

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults My 5 year-old-granddaughter knew the speed dial number on my daughter's phone. Without my daughter's knowledge, my granddaughter called me and left the following message. "Grandma, you are so very, very, very, very pretty, but you're old and you might die. At the end of her message, I heard my daughter yell, "who are you talking to!?" Granddaughter quickly said, "I love you grandma. Bye." Click. I was 50 at the time.

meadowsrock , Kampus Production Report

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#6

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults Not to me but to a friend who is a smoker. She was coughing alot due to a cold and being a smoker. Child was 3 at the time. He looks at her and says, " you are going to die." We all looked shocked and i tell him thats not nice to say to people. My friend however replies, " well then am i going to heaven or hell? And he says, " just go to a doctor."

sevensantana7 , Olya Prutskova Report

By the way, this was noticed long before the advent of cinema - remember the great fairy tale by Hans Christian Andersen - The Emperor’s New Clothes? While all the courtiers were trying their best to flatter their monarch, who was being deceived by clever swindlers allegedly 'inventing' invisible fabric, a random little boy in the crowd, not fearing the consequences, just shouted: 'Hey, the emperor is naked!' By the way, this is probably the best example from world culture of kids being honest yet brutal at the same time.

#7

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults Years ago, I brought my then-girlfriend to my parents vacation house for the first time & introduced her to my entire family.

I was grabbing a beer out of our little fridge in the garage when out of nowhere my 8 year old nephew says "She is way too good for you, Uncle Flip". I just stared at him & he just laughed.

I married her, we are happy, but he still was not wrong.

flip-top , Priscilla Du Preez Report

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#8

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults So while my wife and I were living in her parents guest house, we'd see her niece and nephew visit a lot.

One day, I got fired from my job. And for a while after, the kids would wonder why I was home during the day.

My niece comes up to the guest house door.

**Niece: hey uncle? How come you're not at work?**

Me: I already told you, I got fired. That means they let me go and don't want me to come back to work.

**Niece: Oh...**

-nephew comes up-

*Nephew: HEY UNCLE WHY ARE YOU HOME ALL THE TIME NOW?*

**Niece: He did a bad job, so now they don't want him to go to work**

*Nephew: Why? Is he stupid?*

Me: .....

-both kids wander off without letting me explain further-


Th-thanks kids. My self esteem needed that

**edit:** so im getting questions on why I was fired.
I was working as a stocker at a big-box store at the time. I was under a lot of stress at the time, from college and family and work and etc etc...
Well. One day it all just kinda exploded. I had this super aggressive breakdown where I was throwing merchandise, breaking things. I took a tire iron (still i the package) and tried to smash a few boxes in the back room.

It was bad. Im not proud of it. But sure enough, it got seen and I was let go pretty quick. And the thing is? It all got set off because I couldn't find the right spot on the shelf for some item in the auto department.

So when my nephew said, **"is he stupid?"** that actually hurt. Because I felt really goddamn stupid for losing my temper so hard.

anon , Andrea Piacquadio Report

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#9

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults Was having a father-daughter moment with my then 6 year old. She was worried about something but was struggling to open up to me. Eventually she did.

Me: you can always talk to me about anything. I'll always be there for you. Even when you're all grown up.

She: if you're still alive.

FrannyyU , Josh Willink Report

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TheGoodBoi
Community Member
1 year ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Ohhh I did this when I was little sort of. I had just learned the concept of death, and I almost passed out crying thinking my parents were about to die. All they could do was face palm I'm sure lol

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“In fact, there is nothing bad or reprehensible about kids being so brutally honest with adults,” says Irina Matveeva, a psychologist and certified NLP specialist, whom Bored Panda asked for a comment here. “This is simply the child’s psyche as is, untouched by numerous conventions and rules invented by adults. It is then that the child will learn lies from adults, and the main motivation, alas, will be fear.”

"Fear of possible punishment, fear of doing something wrong, fear of upsetting parents, friends or acquaintances. Fear, desire to assert oneself, desire to be praised - and so we're saying something that is not what it really is, not what we see - but what 'needs to be said in this particular situation.' On the one hand, this is socialization and adaptation to human society. On the other hand, who and when will tell us the undisguised truth, except our own yesterday's toddlers?" Irina summarizes.

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#10

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults Four-year-old nephew, setting the table for dinner -- looks at me and announces, "you get the big fork, because you're the fattest!" And then proceeds to set my place with the BBQ fork. Lol.

Squirrel_Bandit , Matheus Frade Report

#11

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults "Your glasses are weird, what do you look like without them?" *takes them off* "Ew, put them back on"

sheribubble , Ketut Subiyanto Report

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TheGoodBoi
Community Member
1 year ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

The horror on my child's face when she saw me without a beard the very first time. Unfortunately I couldn't...put it back on...

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#12

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults A couple weeks ago my fiance and I got into an argument and my 9 year old step daughter told me "you aren't the best boyfriend, but you are a really good dad." Simultaneously made me really proud and feel really s****y.

Csonkus41 , Matheus Rodrigues Report

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Brainmas
Community Member
1 year ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Sometimes kids give the best reality checks without even trying. They see everything.

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Yes, our own kids sometimes look incredibly funny while telling this naked truth straight to our faces. But you know what - sometimes it’s worth listening to this truth spoken by that thin voice, as who knows, maybe this is a reason to change something in yourself? Well, or at least laugh heartily at yourself, because self-irony is one of those wonderful feelings that develop in us over the years.

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So now please feel free to scroll and read this selection of stories to the very end, and probably add your own tale for us to enjoy. After all it was once said that 'truth came out of the mouths of babes,' and it's one more absolute truth to be said...

#13

"Daddy, why do you have so many wives?"

My 3 year old, Disney princess movie obsessed, daughter said to me. I was a single, 20 y.o. dad with full custody, so naturally she saw me go through a few different girlfriends. That was the moment I decided things were gonna change.

HashtagSparta Report

#14

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults At the aquarium "wow daddy, that fish is even uglier than you."

Post-Apocalipstick , David Clode Report

#15

My dad is a hardass lawyer that always thinks he's right. One time we were gonna play tennis with a teacher and he couldn't come and got mad when I said I didn't want to go either then. I yelled at him that the only reason I play tennis is to play with him. He looked so shocked and never has pushed me to play tennis without him again. It's the one thing I remember my dad truly taking to heart and realizing tennis for me isn't really about the sport.

Edit: my dad also dyed his hair for a long time and it always kind of looked purple in the sun. I told him a million times that it looked purple and he never believed me. One day at said tennis courts a little five year old walks up to him and asks "why is your hair purple?". He dyed it a different color the next day. We still laugh about it.

Dirtybux Report

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#16

"Your breath really stinks!"
That was my daughter, and the last time I ever had a cigarette.

anon Report

#17

So this is actually something I said to my dad when I was the innocent age of four.
Preface: my dad worked a lot, so I didn't spend that much time with him. Also, he was kind of a d**k.

Dad: "who's your favorite daddy?"
Me: "I like Heather's daddy."
Dad: "But I'm your favorite, right?"
Me: "No I like Heather's daddy."

"Heather's daddy" is my uncle, and a great guy. Still makes me feel badly when I think about it. Adults can hurt your feelings, but kids can go straight for your soul.

DrMeezy Report

#18

Not me, but a female friend of mine.

See, we were at a kindergarten helping out, and this kid comes up to her and the following hilarious conversation ensues:

>Kid: "Are you a girl?"
>Friend: "Yeees..."
>Kid: "So, do you have boobs, too?"
>Friend: "Yes, I do."

The little boy examines her head to toe, and then after some thinking follows up with:

>"And where?"

We nearly died laughing, with my friend having a small existential crisis about how flat-chested she apparently was. Children are so brutally honest.

AmBozz Report

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Lost Penny
Community Member
1 year ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

When I worked at Borders, we'd have Character Saturdays -- one of us would wear some character suit while the other would read stories about that character. One of those Saturdays, I was Arthur. After the storytime, I come out, start waiving to the kids, do silly little dances -- the whole nine yards. A little girl (maybe 4 or 5) runs towards me, gives me a huge hug, and then just kinda freezes for a second or two. Proceeds to turn her head & yell very loudly: "Mommy!!! Arthur has boobs!!!" Good times.

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#19

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults I've been a bit short tempered lately (stress from work, expenses etc), but I thought I was keeping it under control. Today, while they were goofing around, my wife asked our 3 yr old son 'Is dada a cheeky monkey?' He said 'No, dada angry monkey.'

It's been a few hours since this happened, but I'm still feeling a mix of surprised, ashamed and sad.

Edit: Thanks for all the support and advice! I'm sorry I haven't replied to every comment, but there are a lot of them :p I do appreciate every one, though!

aardvarkyardwork , Gordon Report

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Fussy1
Community Member
1 year ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

We all have our angry monkey days, try not to let them overshadow the best monkey ever days!

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#20

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults I went to China to teach at an English summer camp. It was a month long experience, and during that time the children all got to pick American names. These ranged from Tommy to Robot.

One day the kids thought it would be fun to give me a Chinese name. The host teacher mentioned that my real name is very close to the Chinese word for beautiful, so I should take that as my name.

The kids all paused for a minute thinking about it, before one popped up and said, "Not so much beautiful, but still very nice."

Thanks kid.

Edit: [Bonus photo of our Halloween party.](http://imgur.com/gallery/bWVLy)

Edit 2: Yes, I'm the white person.

Edit 3: Thanks for all the love and subsequent ginger hatred.

anon , anon Report

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#21

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults Me: Tell me a joke.

My 4 year old: You're a joke.

I had been reading a thread where everyone was sharing jokes they've been told by kids, and I was curious what my son would come up with. I expected something hilariously random. I got emotionally wrecked instead.

Not going to lie, I was pretty impressed.

Ghost_withthemost , www.meme-arsenal.com Report

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Zoey Rayne
Community Member
1 year ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

The harness of this response rest entirely on how much your 4 year old understood what that combination of words meant or if he was just repeating something he'd heard elsewhere.

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#22

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults My 4yo said to my Portuguese wife who was pregnant at the time and hormones were all jacked up, "mommy why is your lip fuzzy." I never saw her leave that quickly for the salon.

She also said to me. "Daddy I like cuddling with you because you are soft and squishy like a bear." To the gym I go!!

DrunkenYeti13 , Daniel Duarte Report

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Linouchka
Community Member
1 year ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

I'll take "soft and squishy" over "fat and wobbly" in a heartbeat! 🥰

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#23

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults "Are you having a baby or just fat?"

I'm male.

BlairEllis , Towfiqu barbhuiya Report

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#24

my daughter has just started talking, pointed at a hippo at the zoo and said 'dada' and then smiled at her dada

blairmatthews Report

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Mel Jackson
Community Member
1 year ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

My kid & niece were about 2 y/o and on a family trip to the zoo saw 2 chimps hugging each other and both shouted (really loud 😂) "Look, it's Dada!" their respective father's were pushing their strollers, and both blushed 😂😂😂 They also saw a huge orangutan and declared that it was their Uncle Danny (yes, he's ginger) and refused to accept anything else. 🤦‍♀️🤷‍♀️

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#25

What's that ugly thing on your shoulders? Wait, it's just your head.

I don't care if youre 8, you're not too young for a tombstone piledriver.

ooSuitsyousir Report

#26

"My sister is just using you to make her ex boyfriend jealous."


Boy was that kid right too....

natephant Report

#27

Brat to my then pregnant wife: "Are you fat?"

Minimally-embarrassed parent: "Jordan, is that how we talk?"

Brat: "Sorry... Are you shaped like a ball?"

I'll be paying for this later, kid. Thanks.

aedroogo Report

#28

I delivered mail for a period of time in 80s. I was about to put mail in the box and could hear a kid behind the door say, "Hey mom, the mailman is here and he's black!" I laughed.

Stuntedatpuberty Report

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Nice Beast Ludo
Community Member
1 year ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Lol I can just picture this little kid peeping through the mail slot updating the mother on all the goings-on of the neighborhood

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#29

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults A kid in a Cambodian orphanage came up to me and said simply "big boobs." I'm a man.

Hines_Ward , Bailey Torres Report

#30

I was in my early thirties and my 12 year-old daughter made a comment about me being an old man. I said "Hey, you're gonna be old someday too, you know," and she smirked and said "Yeah, but not today."

Benjaphar Report

#31

Me (while visiting my sister and niece, and easing my bulk off the floor): "Ooh, I'm getting old."
5 year old niece: "I can see that."

Ouch.

MarkStones Report

#32

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults "Your head looks like a shape."

Cut me deep, Benjamin. You cut me deep.

spacemansplifffff , Ketut Subiyanto Report

#33

you're fat. I replied "Thanks. And you're short."

Footpeter Report

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#34

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults A dead serious 3 year old little kid who straight up asked me "Why are you ugly?" No ill intent behind it, wasn't being mean. The little guy just wanted to know.

Anonymity273 , Hannah Tasker Report

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Sans Serif (Sans)
Community Member
1 year ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

A few of these center around "ugly" I wonder what their criteria is? What is beauty to a 3 to 8 year old?

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#35

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults Standing with my two fat friends in grocery store. We are all fat. Kid comes around the corner in cart pushed by mom and exclaims "Mommy those guys are fat!" Mom looks us over and nods in approval. No f***s given.

titty_burger , Towfiqu barbhuiya Report

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#36

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults Was waiting for my daughter to get her coat and boots on at daycare and another little girl walked up to me. She was probably about six. She told me her parents got a divorce so she was just like my daughter now. I nodded at her and then I got this gem.
"I get to go one week with my mommy and one week with my daddy. Today I go with my daddy. He has a new girlfriend and shes WAY WAY WAY more pretty than my mom. I wish my mom was as pretty as my daddy's girlfriend."
I just cringed.

nsdr1709 , BBC Creative Report

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Zoey Rayne
Community Member
1 year ago

This comment is hidden. Click here to view.

I wonder how old she'll be before she realizes that her mom is prettier than the kind of dad who would leave his wife for a younger/hotter woman.

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#37

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults When I was a kid the Spice Girls were huge and I was obsessed with them. Apparently on the radio they were talking about what an American Spice Girl would be called and came up with "Fat Ugly Spice" or something like that -- I have no recollection of this but my mom tells me that I got so excited and started freaking out saying something along the lines of "Mom, oh my god, you could be a Spice Girl!" She called her sister and cried for hours after that one.

EDIT: Sorry to be clear, it wasn't The Spice Girls saying this, it was an American morning show joking around (can't have my childhood heroes taking the heat!). Hoping my mom knew I was an idiot and didn't mean it!

thedogdaysareover , Themeplus Report

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J Adams
Community Member
1 year ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

My cousins boyfriend at the time used to call my mum ‘old spice’

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#38

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults I was about 16. Young kid (maybe 6 or 7) in front of me in church turns around, stares for three seconds, states, "you got a lot of pimples." Turns back around.

He was not wrong.

onewheeloneil , Ike louie Natividad Report

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R.A. Haley
Community Member
1 year ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

Not sure what's going on with that girl in the picture, but I'd very much like to meet her. She looks like an enchanted forest creature that is only visible on the night of the full moon. *That*, my friends, is beauty.

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#39

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults My daddy's hair is going away, too.

[In my head] NOOOOOOO

hugedrunkrobot , Timur Weber Report

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Hey!
Community Member
1 year ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

I was telling my husband that his head started to have a hole (hair). He didn't believe me. A few weeks after, he had to appear in front of council and it's televised and saw the replay, with the back of his head showing off the clearing... LOL.

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#40

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults "I am this way because of you, so you're just going to have to deal with it"

My teenage daughter. Like hell I will.

stacyg28 , Ketut Subiyanto Report

#41

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults My nephew told me my breath smelled bad. I told him I was sure it did smell bad, since I hadn't eaten all day, but that he should avoid saying mean things even if they were true.

A different nephew once asked my cousin "Are you Jane? Or are you Anne?" She said "I'm Jane. Anne is my sister." The nephew responds "Oh, right. I remember. Anne is the one who's pretty."

Netflix_and_backrubs , Elle Hughes Report

#42

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults "Wanna play?"

"Sorry, I'm not feeling great today"

"Ugh, you're only sad because your girlfriend broke up with you!"

Thanks kid, you really helped me figure that one out.

the-cschnepf , Keira Burton Report

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#43

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults "Are you a kid or a grown up?"

I'm almost 30.

kaykaykaykaykay , Alexander Grey Report

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Dread Pirate Roberts
Community Member
1 year ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

As someone who's in her early 30s but still looks like a teenager, I've gotten a lot of funny comments and questions like this 😂

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#44

While we were in a car, and I was enjoying music.

"What's your favorite band?"

I tell her

"Can we listen to the exact opposite of that? Because I ***HATE*** ***EVERYTHING*** ***YOU*** ***LOVE***!"

ripped my f*****g soul in half.

Was my ex gfs 10 year old daughter.

Outrageous_Claims Report

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Brainmas
Community Member
1 year ago DotsCreated by potrace 1.15, written by Peter Selinger 2001-2017

While most 10 year olds are pretty cool, some of the meanest people I've even met were 10-11 year old girls. I worked at a school. It was brutal.

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#45

This wasn't said to me but when we were in a waiting room, my brother who was approximately 6 at the time said to an elderly woman, "You're gonna die sooner."

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#46

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults I called up my daughter and the grandson came running to the phone, "Is that Am'ma?".

*phone is handed over*

"Hey, Am'ma, can you come over to my house right now?"

"No, honey, I have class tonight, then work tomorrow."

*hears phone moving*

"Just hang up on her" as he hands the phone back to his mom.

Edit: I am not Asian, Chinese, Hispanic, Filipino, Icelandic or Indian. Bible Belt American Grandma that is going to college, with a black mixed grandson that calls me Am'ma.

babywhiz , Vitolda Klein Report

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#47

I bought my niece a set of Disney Princess barbies. The next year I game back home to visit and she was missing one.

Me: "Where's Ariel?"
Her: "Oh. She had red hair."

Galaxysight Report

#48

People Share 35 Comments From Little Kids That Seemed So Innocent To Them But Stunned The Adults "You look like Jack Black in Goosebumps!" -My son's friend who is no longer welcome in my house.

Bmac1977 , vagueonthehow Report